"Socialist Libertarian " - anyone heard of such a thing?

[OverkillZJ]

Just curious. It's the first I've heard the term. I'm currently arguing with someone I've never agreed with politically, but currently she's a "sotial liberal" - how the **** is the possible? To ever definition I can combine of socialist and libertrairn, there is ZERO crossover. They are opposites in my opinion.

Anyone care to argue or enlighten me?

[Jeepin'Jones]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarian (http://http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarianism)
Ah damn link doesn't work but go to Wikipedia. It mentions it
(http://http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarianism)

[OverkillZJ]

Thanks for the link (sarcasm) - and by the way it's http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libertarianism

I was asking if anyon'd actually heard of it, not linds to research.

I am a Libertarian - I can state the purpose. The nazi part of it was new to me. I was simply curious if anyone else had hear of it....

[TimMichaels]

Just curious. It's the first I've heard the term. I'm currently arguing with someone I've never agreed with politically, but currently she's a "sotial liberal" - how the **** is the possible? To ever definition I can combine of socialist and libertrairn, there is ZERO crossover. They are opposites in my opinion.

Anyone care to argue or enlighten me?


I've heard the term Libertarian Socialism. Assuming it's the same thing, it does have a sort of twisted way of making sense (the connection that is, not the beliefs themselves.)

According to Libertarian Socialism, the only way for a true libertarian society within which all rights are equal is to essentially eliminate the catalyst of power struggles which would be the ownership of production. By socializing all industry, it is theoretically impossible to have any hiearchy economically which in turn eliminates social hierarchy as well. The proliteriat becomes universal and therefore the society is more libertarian.

Of course the flaw is that the power structure isn't truly eliminated, it is merely shifted to the government.

This may or may not be what your friend is talking about. Been awhile since I studied this sort of stuff.

[OverkillZJ]

Interesting - it actually makes sense, but it's based on the assumption that governement will never be corrupt or selfish for its own needs (which I feel being run by humans, is impossible.)

[TimMichaels]

Exactly. In the end all it does is concentrate the power into the government, which will inevitably be corrupted by greed as it is human, so all that is accomplished is narrowing the elite.

[OverkillZJ]

I need to remember this conversation. It either proves that social liberals are NUTS, or woman are dee dee dee's - or a combination of both...

And proves many girls I had the idocy to date were highly INSANE (there's an opening for the peanut gallery...)

[OverkillZJ]

Ok. I've realized 2 things arguing with this girl (the first of which I knew before).

1. She's absolutely brilliant, it's not often I feel (almost) stupid, but I do in this case.

2. What makes smart people think that the inadequacies of the normal people will be solved by a government of also normal people governing the rest?
Seriously.. they see people SCREW UP, and say hey, lets make a government OF People TO FIX IT. Does anyone else see an issue here?

I know I'm just the average Joe, but seriously, does logic just escape some people, brilliant or not, or am I missing something?

[Bird_Flu]

I like boobies!!!

[DMG]

I've heard the term Libertarian Socialism. Assuming it's the same thing, it does have a sort of twisted way of making sense (the connection that is, not the beliefs themselves.)

According to Libertarian Socialism, the only way for a true libertarian society within which all rights are equal is to essentially eliminate the catalyst of power struggles which would be the ownership of production. By socializing all industry, it is theoretically impossible to have any hiearchy economically which in turn eliminates social hierarchy as well. The proliteriat becomes universal and therefore the society is more libertarian.

Of course the flaw is that the power structure isn't truly eliminated, it is merely shifted to the government.

This may or may not be what your friend is talking about. Been awhile since I studied this sort of stuff.

Libertarianism is not about eliminating power struggles between people, it is about eliminating or reducing the government's scope and power.
What you described is just about the dead opposite of Libertarian. And pure fawking jibberish.

[DMG]

Just curious. It's the first I've heard the term. I'm currently arguing with someone I've never agreed with politically, but currently she's a "sotial liberal" - how the **** is the possible? To ever definition I can combine of socialist and libertrairn, there is ZERO crossover. They are opposites in my opinion.

Anyone care to argue or enlighten me?

A social liberal is not even close to a social Libertarian. Especially considering what liberal has come to mean in this country.

[BAD_GNR]

I like boobies!!!


Hooray for boobies!!!:026:

[Deadman 94 xj]

I've heard the term Libertarian Socialism. Assuming it's the same thing, it does have a sort of twisted way of making sense (the connection that is, not the beliefs themselves.)

According to Libertarian Socialism, the only way for a true libertarian society within which all rights are equal is to essentially eliminate the catalyst of power struggles which would be the ownership of production. By socializing all industry, it is theoretically impossible to have any hiearchy economically which in turn eliminates social hierarchy as well. The proliteriat becomes universal and therefore the society is more libertarian.

Of course the flaw is that the power structure isn't truly eliminated, it is merely shifted to the government.

This may or may not be what your friend is talking about. Been awhile since I studied this sort of stuff.


This, I believe, would be Marxism. The problem with that theory is it eventually leads to communism. Socialist Communist? lol

[OverkillZJ]

Libertarianism is not about eliminating power struggles between people, it is about eliminating or reducing the government's scope and power.
What you described is just about the dead opposite of Libertarian. And pure fawking jibberish.

Dave - he wasn't speaking to the Libertarian you or I know - and from what I've read socialist libertarian isn't something you'd want, and is a bumch of pure fawkin jibberish...

It doesn't sound far from Marxism.

[TimMichaels]

Libertarianism is not about eliminating power struggles between people, it is about eliminating or reducing the government's scope and power.
What you described is just about the dead opposite of Libertarian. And pure fawking jibberish.


Ok cool.

[TimMichaels]

Ok. I've realized 2 things arguing with this girl (the first of which I knew before).

1. She's absolutely brilliant, it's not often I feel (almost) stupid, but I do in this case.

2. What makes smart people think that the inadequacies of the normal people will be solved by a government of also normal people governing the rest?
Seriously.. they see people SCREW UP, and say hey, lets make a government OF People TO FIX IT. Does anyone else see an issue here?

I know I'm just the average Joe, but seriously, does logic just escape some people, brilliant or not, or am I missing something?

The problem is that many people who are truly intelligent become idealist as they begin to think that everyone must be intelligent and benevolent, which is far from the truth.

[OverkillZJ]

I like boobies!!!

FTW! Just not socliast liberterian boobs:064:

[Muzikman]

When it comes to boobies, why discriminate?

[Bird_Flu]

The problem is that many people who are truly intelligent become idealist as they begin to think that everyone must be intelligent and benevolent, which is far from the truth.
Quoted for truth.

[Bird_Flu]

When it comes to boobies, why discriminate?
Because you don't just get the boobies, often there are additional responsibilities from enjoying boobies. Men need to be sure the boobies are compatible with them otherwise you get unexpected results.

[OverkillZJ]

When it comes to boobies, why discriminate?

Because some boobies have the crazy marxist/socialist libertraian attached!

[ridgerunner97]

When it comes to boobies, why discriminate?

Especially nice boobies :003:

[BAD_GNR]

Maybe this is how we got a boobie elected for president.

[Christopher]

I think the other reason is these people FEEL that mankind defaults to ultimate good when in fact the opposite is true. Mankind will always seek to consolidate power if there is no checks and balances.
As our constiution restrains our government.
What they need is a simple understanding of history. They want eveything to be equal when it can never be... Unless you have some entity with ultimate control dictating the outcomes.

Good discussion

[ridgerunner97]

you spelled it wrong, I think you meant baboonie LOL, i'm bad hahaha