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View Full Version : Engine swap 5.2 or 5.9?



DeathBlade556
06-29-2010, 03:26 PM
The 2.5L has pissed me off of the last time! Stalled out when making a turn on 65 this morning, and thats it! I'm going to do a engine swap no more dealing with my sensor a week 2.5!


I'm now debating if I want a jeep/dodge 5.2(318) or a 5.9(360) Not much HP diffence and the 5.2 has a little better mpg, but is harder to find now than a 5.9
I would grap the entire drive train of the donor, computer, ECU, harness, etc. I wound just need to find the right donor, lowish miles and not in Timbuktu.

I found this site and its seems to be a help
http://backwoodsoffroad.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display.cgi?cat=4


What say you pghofftopic?

ridgerunner97
06-29-2010, 03:29 PM
5.9L Just for the pure fact that you are goin through the hassle to swap a v8 in, why do a 5.2 when you can have the 5.9L :) And my hat is off to you Gabe for keepin it mopar powered and not bein like everyone else with a v8 wrangler stuffin a bowtie powerplant in it.

DeathBlade556
06-29-2010, 03:37 PM
Its the fact I want my stock gauges to work, for the mopar motors its just splicing my harness together with the FSMs

dan58
06-29-2010, 05:46 PM
Why bother with that mopar crap? 5.3 Chevy all the way!

ridgerunner97
06-29-2010, 06:21 PM
shut up dan! LOL

Ragnorox
06-29-2010, 08:31 PM
http://ajarnforum.net/vb/images/smilies/loser.gif
Why bother with that mopar crap? 5.3 Chevy all the way!http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/images/smilies/icon_smile_screwy.gif

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/images/smilies/flame.gifGo suck a bowtie!http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/images/smilies/tool.gif

Super Scout
06-29-2010, 10:36 PM
ummmmm what Dan said.....


Please Dont Hit me lol

Ragnorox
06-29-2010, 10:45 PM
Shut up Steve!

toocheaptosmoke
06-29-2010, 11:19 PM
Get a 3/4 ton ram with the 5.2, NV241, and a NV4500 5 speed, good mileage and not enough power to break a whole lot. :p:

2002wranglerX
06-30-2010, 07:49 AM
Its the fact I want my stock gauges to work, for the mopar motors its just splicing my harness together with the FSMs

All the factory gauges in my yj worked with my chevy 4.3 swapped in

dan58
06-30-2010, 08:35 AM
Hard to admit that Mopar has only ever made one motor that's worth it's weight (426 hemi) compared to GM? Do a side-by-side comparison of the 5.2/5.9 to a GM 5.3. It's not even a fair fight.


http://ajarnforum.net/vb/images/smilies/loser.gifhttp://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/images/smilies/icon_smile_screwy.gif

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/images/smilies/flame.gifGo suck a bowtie!http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/images/smilies/tool.gif

SirFuego
06-30-2010, 09:19 AM
What axle/tire combo you looking to run?

DeathBlade556
06-30-2010, 09:30 AM
Got a 3:73 D30/D35 going to switch out the D35 for a 8.8 in the rear soon.
Currently running 31x10.50s but might upgrade to a 33x10.50 sooner or later.

I was looking at the 5.9 because is was a jeep engine, the simple wiring harness work and I saw a an emssions law that said "same year or newer and offered by the manufacturer"

I'm really open to any engine that I can get semi-cheaply and not have to get xfer case adapter for and not run two computers. The 5.9 if I get it from a durango should come with of allow me to bolt up the NP231.

Ragnorox
06-30-2010, 10:59 AM
I am sorry to tell ya Dan, but my old 5.9 has dragged a few 5.3s across parking lots before in bar pull offs. I did have one almost pull me back wards but he blew tire. Thats enough side by side for me. Of course I am paying for all those shenanigans now!

dan58
06-30-2010, 01:18 PM
Going by hard numbers, not a "pull off" (which, IMHO, tells you more about the traction of the tires than your motor). Let's not get into the aftermarket parts availability. The 6.0 can go 400HP with a tune and bolt ons.

Magnum 5.9: 245hp/335tq
Chevy 5.3: 310hp/335tq - this is also an aluminum engine that weighs close to 125 pounds less than that 5.9.
Chevy 6.0: 225/370

Super Scout
06-30-2010, 01:21 PM
All i know is this when ole ridgerunner rode in my basically stock chevy 5.3 and I stood on it the first words out of his mouth right after his s$%t eating grin were "what do you have done too this" and I said a cold air intake lol. He is a mopar man and he was surprised tho im sure he will deny it now LOL.

OverkillZJ
06-30-2010, 02:06 PM
Holy crap, who cares, either motor is a MASSIVE improvement over the 2.5 - let him run what he wants to.

2002wranglerX
06-30-2010, 02:09 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7x-o-ZCPcc&feature=youtube_gdata

Looks close enough to me that it doesn't matter.

either way, do you really NEED that much HP/TQ in a trail rig?

my new TJ has a 4.5 stroker, and last time out on the trail i don't think i EVER went WOT... the TQ numbers between the 5.3 and the 5.9 are so similar i don't think it's going to matter.

Super Scout
06-30-2010, 02:10 PM
Lol I dont care what engine Gabe runs, I just like busting ragnaroxs stones lol.

DeathBlade556
06-30-2010, 02:26 PM
Matt,(Overkill) what kind of mileage do you get in the 5.9?

2002wranglerX
06-30-2010, 02:30 PM
Matt,(Overkill) what kind of mileage do you get in the 5.9?

Mine got 11-13. that was with 32's

OverkillZJ
06-30-2010, 02:33 PM
Matt,(Overkill) what kind of mileage do you get in the 5.9?

Between 4 and 15, it depends how much smoke I want to make.

City, 9-10, highyway about 15. You'd do better with less weight, but it's not a gas sipper.

DeathBlade556
06-30-2010, 02:36 PM
So a 1 to 5 less mpg than the 2.5l, not bad, I get 13-15mpg.

Would like to get a little better mpg but for HP/TQ difference between the 2.5 and the 5.9 its not bad.

I wonder if there are any fuel mileage chips out there that actually work?

(wait the ZJ is 3197lbs and my TJ is 4360lbs I'd get even worse mileage)

2002wranglerX
06-30-2010, 02:47 PM
So a 1 to 5 less mpg than the 2.5l, not bad, I get 13-15mpg.

Would like to get a little better mpg but for HP/TQ difference between the 2.5 and the 5.9 its not bad.

I wonder if there are any fuel mileage chips out there that actually work?

(wait the ZJ is 3197lbs and my TJ is 4360lbs I'd get even worse mileage)

i never saw 15 mpg outa my 5.9 ZJ... but i bet you'd be about the same as you are now.

OverkillZJ
06-30-2010, 02:53 PM
I get 15 if it's truly nothing but highway, as in on ramp to offramp. The 5.2 I'd see 16 on, same scenario, either way it's nothing to brag about, I got the same in the diesel suburban towing the buggy, and that was over twice the weight.

beat1078
06-30-2010, 03:18 PM
Let him "borrow" your engine so he can run some "tests"

2002wranglerX
06-30-2010, 03:18 PM
A couple issues i just thought of.

1. you are doing the tranny too right? the tranies in the ZJ's aren't known for being great, supposedly the one in the 5.9 is a little better and has the starter on the other side.

2. your 231 supposedly won't work. well, it might work, but i've read the 4 cyl np231's have a smaller input shaft that's much more likely to go under heavy hp/tq. you can swap the input planetaries either way so you can use your 231, but you might want to research that a bit.

DeathBlade556
06-30-2010, 03:58 PM
Well I was going to try to keep the 46RE that behind most 5.9s

And for the 231 the 2.5L with the AX-5 should have a 21 spline input but It the pages I was looking at are right the 30rh should have a 23 spline behind it.

OverkillZJ
06-30-2010, 04:57 PM
A couple issues i just thought of.

1. you are doing the tranny too right? the tranies in the ZJ's aren't known for being great, supposedly the one in the 5.9 is a little better and has the starter on the other side.

2. your 231 supposedly won't work. well, it might work, but i've read the 4 cyl np231's have a smaller input shaft that's much more likely to go under heavy hp/tq. you can swap the input planetaries either way so you can use your 231, but you might want to research that a bit.


Not sure where you got your information, but the starter is on the same side, and the 231 is ever so slightly stronger than the 242, which was found behind the 5.9 in some configurations (though never a Jeep.) So far my 242 is holding up behind it...

DeathBlade556
06-30-2010, 06:04 PM
I think he is talking about the 46RE transmission being weak, I just searched about it and it seams the explode alot anywhere from 12-120k mile but 43k-70k seams to be the average for the "my 46re when boom" threads though it looks you can swap the internals of a 47RE from behind a 5.9 cummins into the 46re for more strength.

OverkillZJ
06-30-2010, 07:58 PM
The one in my 5.9 lasted until 191,000 - that's why it was free, came with a blown transmission. What's amazing is that it blew becausue of a radiator failure though, the coolant and tranny fluid channels rusted out between each other and crossed, sending coolant into the transmission.

PatF10
06-30-2010, 08:28 PM
just another thing to think about with Jeep 5.9 is that they require premium gas so thats another expense.

OverkillZJ
06-30-2010, 08:31 PM
It depends on the ECU programming. Most of them were nuteured by a TSB in 2001 or so (mine included unfortunately) in order to run on mid-low, since people were too retarded to realize they required premium, even with the gian sticker on the fuel door, I can run 87 with no issues or pinging, but I'm sure I lost some power.

PatF10
07-01-2010, 08:51 PM
didnt know that matt, nice little bit of info. guess my brothers didnt get that it pings like crazy without premium

DeathBlade556
07-03-2010, 10:28 AM
Looking at the mpg of the 5.9 I wonder it I should be looking at the 4.7?

busij44
07-03-2010, 10:51 AM
Friend of mine just swapped a 5.2 out of a Dakota P/U into his TJ. He used tranny (manual) too. Only thing he swapped was the 231. It had wrong splines I think. Advance adapters makes motor mounts to do this. Other than some electrical gremlins he is pretty happy with it.

2002wranglerX
07-03-2010, 07:07 PM
Looking at the mpg of the 5.9 I wonder it I should be looking at the 4.7?

Jp did an article on how not worth it that swap is. I guess its a huge pain.

DeathBlade556
07-04-2010, 07:56 AM
I can see why after looking at some wiring diagrams. I think it has 5 signal wires compatible with a 4.0 you would have to swap the entire wiring harness, but if your willing to do that I dont see why it wouldn't work, size is comparable to a 5.2 But I'm not into that much work.

I guess I'm looking for a 5.2 or 5.9 again

Anybody know of a place where to can bid on totaled cars/trucks?
I found www.salvagedirect.com but you need to be a member(that had a nice 5.9 durango with only 74k go for $1200)
But you have to be a junk yard to be a member.

LordAthens
07-04-2010, 10:21 AM
I vote for the 5.2L, for no reason other than I more than likely got my hands on a drivetrain out of a 99 Ram Van 1500 and as such, I'll be doing that swap at some point. Though I'm probably going to junk the auto tranny and keep the NV3550 that I swapped in when I did the stroker build last year.

2002wranglerX
07-04-2010, 12:08 PM
Chrysler/Jeep 4.7L V-8 The candidate: The Chrysler 4.7L overhead cam first saw Jeep duty in the '99 Grand Cherokee and wormed its way into the Dodge Dakota and fullsize Ram platforms as well The perception: For under $3,000, I can pick up a thrashed Grand Cherokee with the 4.7L and five-speed auto tranny and put it in my trail Jeep. The reality: Have you ever looked under the hood of a 4.7L powered Grand Cherokee? Besides looking like a nightmare to extricate, the WJ's overhead cam 4.7L is super-wide, very complex, and only puts out around 235-265hp. And again, there's very little in the way of aftermarket harness and ECU support to make the swap easy The exception: We really can't think of any We think: If you want modern V-8 power, you'll be way better off finding a wrecked Silverado and nabbing the 5.3L Vortec engine inste

DeathBlade556
09-19-2010, 04:46 PM
After searching hill and dale, fighting my 2.5 tooth and nail to get it to pass emissions, I think I might of found an engine.

Crowsrun said they had a 1998 5.2L with 82k out of a 1500 for $500 and from what I can see there is no differences between the 98 and 2000 5.2s
Though I did find a 2001 5.2L in ohio near columbus with 64k for $399 with no accessories. But is 190miles one way.
Anybody want to chime in?

wozz
09-19-2010, 07:43 PM
There's no replacement for displacement: 5.9

DeathBlade556
09-19-2010, 08:36 PM
The 5.9 I get even worse gas mileage and have to get a even bigger radiator.

2002wranglerX
09-19-2010, 10:26 PM
http://www.northeastcrawlers.com/necforum/showthread.php?t=8901

DeathBlade556
09-20-2010, 04:11 PM
http://www.northeastcrawlers.com/necforum/showthread.php?t=8901

That might be just what I'm looking for but it is 20k more miles.

2002wranglerX
09-20-2010, 05:47 PM
That might be just what I'm looking for but it is 20k more miles.

just passing it along

Meeke
09-20-2010, 08:55 PM
I'll give you the 5.2 out of my truck if you buy me a 5.9 complete with everything needed to make it work.

2002wranglerX
09-20-2010, 09:05 PM
I'll give you the 5.2 out of my truck if you buy me a 5.9 complete with everything needed to make it work.

how exactly does that benefit him? lol

DeathBlade556
09-20-2010, 09:20 PM
Well It depends on the year and the mileage.

Meeke
09-21-2010, 10:48 AM
how exactly does that benefit him? lol

It really doesn't, that's the point. I would help me get a bigger engine and a platform for a 408 stroker in the future.

ridgerunner97
09-21-2010, 11:18 AM
It really doesn't, that's the point. I would help me get a bigger engine and a platform for a 408 stroker in the future.

I like the way you think! I've always wanted to do a 408 stroker magnum motor...

DeathBlade556
10-24-2010, 09:41 AM
Ok big question. That needs opinions.

I went out to youngstown auto wrecking on friday.
and they had a 5.2 out of a 2000 ram with 130,000 on it and a transmission from a 99 durango with a 5.9L in it with 136,000.

Now they said $1200 for engine, transmission, wiring harness, computer.

Does $1200 sound right for a engine/tranmission with that 130,000 miles?

I need opinions. If its ok I'll go pick it up monday.

justin'sbig7
10-24-2010, 10:29 AM
i would bet you could find a complete older ram that is rusted to hell with a 5.9l driveline for that $$$, but from a wrecking yard, that sounds probably on par as long as theyll allow you to return if theres any problems.... if you break it down, figure $500 for a complete engine, $3 or 400 for the trans if it is working ok, and the wiring and computer (meticulously removed) probably $300. the cheap ass in me says its high, the realist in me says probably about right for wrecking yard prices.

OverkillZJ
10-24-2010, 11:11 AM
I don't care if the trans is working - at 130000+ miles, and built by Chrystler, it'd about to die. I'd only consider that a housing to rebuild...

fmlyof4whlrs
10-24-2010, 11:24 AM
As for transfercasees....some durangos did come with a 242. The weak spot in them seemed to be the output shafts in jeeps but the durangos and hummers had thicker outputs. But that would leave me to believe you can bolt up a 231 or 242 to a durango tranny, just not sure what input shaft you would need.

DeathBlade556
10-24-2010, 03:02 PM
Looked on carpart looks like every tranny out there is between 99k to 140k and they still want $600ish for it. Guess I'm looking for another place for the tranny.
I'll have to see what they would want for just the engine.

OverkillZJ
10-24-2010, 03:04 PM
The 5.2 and ECU from the buggy might be for sale soon, still debating on it. had about 78,000 miles before it became a buggy, so probably still 80,000 miles LOL. Transmission too, but that'd need to be rebuilt - I blew reverse and it's frankly been abused.

DeathBlade556
10-24-2010, 04:15 PM
What year was the buggy? I got to dig up a 2000 to 2003 5.2

OverkillZJ
10-24-2010, 05:03 PM
97. What's the difference?

Meeke
10-24-2010, 06:36 PM
I would stay away from the tranny with that many miles on it. My truck (2000 Ram) has 126k and change and I just had the tranny rebuilt last week.

DeathBlade556
10-24-2010, 07:14 PM
For emissions it should be the same year or newer.

But the parts interchange saids is might work. But if I remember the the jeep 5.2 comes with the 44re transmission a bit lighter than the 46re in the ram1500s

How much did it set you back for the rebuild.

Meeke
10-24-2010, 08:55 PM
rebuild was 1600 and change. Yeah, I have the 46re.

2002wranglerX
10-24-2010, 09:36 PM
they're high on that if you ask me.... but that's just my .02

DeathBlade556
11-05-2010, 09:42 PM
What the spam batman!?

limegreentj
11-05-2010, 09:45 PM
i left him a fun visitor message...lol