Annoying ticket: "Operating a vehicle w/ improper tires."

[OverkillZJ]

A few of you know about this, Beat and I were picking up pizza in the ZJ a month ago, and got pulled over. The officer wasn't the brightest, I think she'd believe her if I told her that the blinker fluid was low.

The sway bars were off, and the front bumper was, well, missing in action. Those are both violations which after reading up are DEFINITELY violations. What'd she have the biggest problem with: the 31.7" DOT approved BFG All Terrain tires. Wow.

The official ticket states: "S 75 4107 B2 OPERATING VEHICLE w/ IMPROPER TIRES"

And I give you, word for word, 75 4107 BW:

(2) Operate, or cause or permit another person to
operate, on any highway in this Commonwealth any vehicle or
combination which is not equipped as required under this part
or under department regulations or when the driver is in
violation of department regulations or the vehicle or
combination is otherwise in an unsafe condition or in
violation of department regulations.

And under "this part" as in the entire contents of 75 - the word tire never refers to size, or original equipment, but only studded tires, racing tires, etc.

It's a $130 something ticket.. where the fine was only $25, and the rest are fees. It's annoying considering that gets them around the statement of:

(2) Any person convicted of violating this subsection
shall be subject to a civil penalty of not more than $100 for
each violation.

Your tax dollars at work. I'll get out of the ticket, but if it wasn't for me being pissed, this wouldn't be worth me losing half of a day of self-employed work to waste sitting in a courtroom.

[muddeprived]

what did she say about the tires?

[OverkillZJ]

If they get REALLY nitpicking I guess they could get me here:

4525. Tire equipment and traction surfaces.
(a) General rule.--No vehicle shall be operated on the
highway unless the vehicle is equipped with tires of a type,
size and construction approved by the department for the vehicle
and unless the tires are in a safe operating condition as
determined in accordance with regulations of the department,
except that commercial implements of husbandry may be equipped
with tires marked for nonhighway use.
(b) Vehicles not equipped with pneumatic tires.--It is
unlawful for any person to operate or move, or cause or permit
to be moved, in contact with any highway any vehicle equipped
with traction or road contact surfaces other than pneumatic
tires unless of a type, size and construction permitted by
regulations of the department and unless the movement is made
under specific conditions allowed by regulations of the
department.
(c) Ice grips and tire studs.--Tires in which ice grips or
tire studs of wear resisting material have been installed which
provide resiliency upon contact with the road and which have
projections not exceeding two thirty-seconds of an inch beyond
the tread of the traction surface of the tire shall be permitted
between November 1 of each year and April 15 of the following
year. The Governor may by executive order extend the time tires
with ice grips or tire studs may be used when highway conditions
are such that such tires would be a safety factor in traveling
Commonwealth highways. The use of tires with ice grips or tire
studs contrary to the provisions of this subsection shall be
unlawful.
(d) Tire chains.--Tire chains may be temporarily used on
vehicles during periods of snow and ice emergency if they are in
conformance with regulations promulgated by the department.
(e) Penalty.--
(1) Any person violating the provisions of subsection
(c) shall be guilty of a summary offense and, upon conviction
thereof, shall be sentenced to pay a fine as indicated in
paragraph (2) and, in default of payment thereof, shall
undergo imprisonment for not more than 30 days.
(2) Fines for violation of subsection (c) relating to
the period of use of ice grips or tire studs shall be
determined from the following chart based on the period of
unauthorized use:
April 16 to May 31 $35
June 1 to June 30 45
July 1 to July 31 55
August 1 to August 31 55
September 1 to September 30 55
October 1 to October 31 55
(3) Fines for any other violation of subsection (c)
shall be determined according to the chart in paragraph (2)
except that fines for violations occurring between November 1
to April 15 shall be $10.
(Nov. 10, 1979, P.L.460, No.95, eff. imd.; July 10, 1984,
P.L.679, No.146, eff. 60 days; May 20, 1993, P.L.30, No.10, eff.
60 days)

[OverkillZJ]

what did she say about the tires?

I believe it was something along the lings of "Oh my god that thing just doesn't move right, i mean somethings wrong it just doesnt look safe. And wow those tires look way too close to the rear doors, you must have an illegal lift or something"

[OverkillZJ]

Interesting...

4969. Permit for movement of vehicles with oversize wheels
and tires (Repealed).

1993 Repeal Note. Section 4969 was repealed May 20, 1993,
P.L.30, No.10, effective in 60 days.

[beat1078]

I believe it was something along the lings of "Oh my god that thing just doesn't move right, i mean somethings wrong it just doesnt look safe. And wow those tires look way too close to the rear doors, you must have an illegal lift or something"

That was about right...and she was swaying back and forth when she was explaining it to us, as if to show us what we were doing incorrectly.
Honestly, the fact that she had to call backup from a MALE motorcycle officer sealed the deal for me that she wasn't operating with a full deck. Now I will give the fact that there are people that don't know anything about a vehicle and to them I offer no offence. With her...she is the reason dumb girl vs car jokes exist.

When is the court date? I want a good laugh when you walk out of this one.

[OverkillZJ]

It's scheduled for 9am July 1st, but I want to be leaving to Colorado at 6am that day, so I'm going to see if I can choose a week window to postpone it too. I have a lot of travel coming up so if they want to just assign another random date, F it.

[BAD_GNR]

And to think you guys gave me a hard time a few years ago when I was whining about getting pulled over for "tires sticking out beyond my flares" specifically, the bulge of the sidewall. The cop admitted that the treads were covered by the flares, but the sidewalls weren't. I think it's just that the economy's that bad, and there are still just as many stupid people out there.

[beat1078]

Wow.
Just let me know the date.

[LordAthens]

If they get REALLY nitpicking I guess they could get me here:

How would that even get you? Articles B, C and D are obviously out (you weren't running solid tires with chains or picks, right? lol ), E is only of penalties so article A would be the only one that I can see applying. They're DOT approved tires, so unless they were bald, dryrotted or the like, I can't see how that would apply in the first place. I could be wrong, but I don't believe there are any governing bodies out there that say what tire can be run on what vehicle in PA, only that it must be DOT approved.

[OverkillZJ]

It states it must be of the size "approved for that vehicle" - but to my knowledge there is nothing that states such.


Just another waste of time.

[LordAthens]

Maybe she couldn't cut it as a SP Trooper? One to many times in the fresh concrete?



That IS a woman in a PA SP cruiser...

[beat1078]

She already pretty much told us that if we fight it she wasn't going to be there remember? The only one losing anything is you for the time you have to take off work and the money you won't be making just because she wanted to flex her girl power at us.

[OverkillZJ]

Can't hotlink, here's pic, haha http://www.funnychill.com/files/funn...n-concrete.jpg

[OverkillZJ]

She already pretty much told us that if we fight it she wasn't going to be there remember? The only one losing anything is you for the time you have to take off work and the money you won't be making just because she wanted to flex her girl power at us.

Apparently City cops NEVER have to show up to court. It's bullshit, they have someoen full time just to sit in court to argue tickets. In other words, I never get to face my accuser.

[LordAthens]

Apparently City cops NEVER have to show up to court. It's bullshit, they have someoen full time just to sit in court to argue tickets. In other words, I never get to face my accuser.

Really? THAT is BS. How can said person argue something for a ticket they know nothing about? Take a speeding ticket, they can't sit there under oath and say "I observed the defendant coming down West Liberty Ave traveling at a speed of 57mph obtained via (insert method here)", right? Wow.

Makes me glad we're looking to move out of this absolutely f'ed up dictatorshi.. I mean state!

[Bill]

I have to interject here... Not because I think the charge is legit, but simply because Brandon is commenting on the legallities of traffic tickets. Does anyone else find this completely hysterical?

Sorry Brandon, you opened yourself up for this one...

[LordAthens]

Considering I have a lot of experience..

You just can't let things go can you?

[Bill]

It was just too easy...

[notmYJ]

I giggled....

[warwagon98xj]

socialism at work the state police force along with fire departments, and public shcools

[BAD_GNR]

It was just too easy...

Like Al's mom?

[skeebs]

Sounds like that lousy bitch would have a freaking field day and a heart attack if she saw me coming down the road....steering all jacked up...jeep hopping all over the lane like I was driving drunk, tires sticking out several inches past the flares, no third brake light, but I think that's all that's wrong with it. And I would be willing to bet she'd probably try and say my home-fab rear bumper was illegal, or the sawzalled front bumper and Warn winch were against vehicle code....

I think she needs someone to tell her to do the world a favor & take a long walk off a short pier.

[ZJ_5.2LIMITED]

damn... so she is saying my Jeep can only have 215/75-15s (= like a 25-27inch).. aww hell no.. it looked stupid for the 2 days they were on b4 i switched to the 31s.. FYI--> my 31s are also BFG ATs and they have a DOT number on them.. and i only know this cause i drag race a lot.. you can have Mickey Thompson racing slicks on your car, as long as there is a DOT number on it, http://www.summitracing.com/search/b.../?autoview=SKU
second sentence next to the tire..

[fmlyof4whlrs]

Was talking to a cop yesterday (we were at the same part not cause I got pulled over) and he said that if the tires aren't the size on the door then you can get pulled over and ticketed. He said the vehicle inspection codes says tires of the size specified on the vehicle. I don't remember that in my inspection book. He said he uses this excuse to pull over people he suspects of selling drugs. Since Cadillac doesn't have any cars that come stock with 22's that is the reason he pulls them over....then they act suspicious so he calls in the dogs. Still I think it is bull since vehicles come with 33 inch tires from the factory who cares if you put 31's or 32's on yours.