Talk about a fart in church...

[Super Scout]

My mom taught first grade for 35 years, she went to work at 8 and left at 4 thats a 7 hour day so your right its hardly an 8 hour day. Two of my best friends teach high school they start at 7 and leave at 2:30 once again hardly an 8 hour day. School is in session 180 days a year. Teachers are off every weekend and every major holiday the entire time school is closed. Some have meetings before and after the school year but that does not account for very many days. Where did your dad teach ? I find it interesting that every teacher I know works 7-7.5 hours a day and I know quite a few. Teachers get some of the best benefits you can get, tons of vacation time, tons of sick time and 3 months off with pay in the summer. Show me one other career path that can match that ? I know what teachers make and I know what they do. Like I said I dont think the should have a pay cut but don't hand me a line as to how hard there job is. Greater latrobe spent millions to add another gym so they would not have to take down the bleachers between games for gym class. That was their honest to god reasoning. California university of pa spent god knows how much to build two towers as an entry way to campus that serve no purpose at all. Wasted money. My buddy is a night Janitor at latrobe makes 18 bucks an hour. As a janitor even he will admit he is over paid. At cal u they ripped out concrete sidewalks and replaced them with brick, than every year would replace any that had a crack. There is a lot of waste, this is just stuff I know from observing and reading the newspaper. I would love to take a look at their budget.
Maybe if schools had some money cut they would take a little better care of what they had. When they start projects attempt to stay within budget. I write scopes of work, and bid projects all the damn time I have yet to have one go over budget. ITs not that hard.

[dan58]

Again, my experience is much different. At school NLT 0730 and could not leave until 1530. Add on a few hours each night to grade papers. And then add more time to write the lesson plans. There's more than a 7.5 hour day. Your school experience may vary, but mine didn't let out until 3:10. Sick or personal days - 3/year. I went to a small school (graduating classes under 100) where they didn't build new things. The HS was built in 1962. There's only been a few additions to it over the years. The elementary school was built in 1992(ish) to replace three very old elementary schools. Perhaps many of the faults lie with parents who demand the best buildings and technology? Their priority has been on the "extras" and not on lower property taxes.

As for state funding, they got VERY little compared to suburban schools. Want them to trim budgets? Give each child across the state the SAME funding. Right now, small schools like my alma mater get the shaft.

[2002wranglerX]

So they work normal work hours for average pay... so what.

Again, my experience is much different. At school NLT 0730 and could not leave until 1530. Add on a few hours each night to grade papers. And then add more time to write the lesson plans. There's more than a 7.5 hour day. Your school experience may vary, but mine didn't let out until 3:10. Sick or personal days - 3/year. I went to a small school (graduating classes under 100) where they didn't build new things. The HS was built in 1962. There's only been a few additions to it over the years. The elementary school was built in 1992(ish) to replace three very old elementary schools. Perhaps many of the faults lie with parents who demand the best buildings and technology? Their priority has been on the "extras" and not on lower property taxes.

As for state funding, they got VERY little compared to suburban schools. Want them to trim budgets? Give each child across the state the SAME funding. Right now, small schools like my alma mater get the shaft.

[dan58]

So they work normal work hours for average pay... so what.

Exactly my point. SS is saying they don't and get great pay.

[Super Scout]

What school did you goto Dan ? Around here that is not the case school districts spend money like drunk sailors. Sure some have less money than others but thats not my point. My point is that REGARDLESS OF TEACHER SALARIES there is a ton of wasted money in education. A TON. That is all.

[dan58]

Northern Bedford. They don't spend it because they don't have it.

[commando72]

Have all the contracts for Westmoreland county schools because I am the Vice President of the Westmoreland County Education Association. If you have some "facts" that are found anywhere but those documents, they are simply not true. Some of the arguments made in these posts have little credibility.

I know this sounds pompous, but facts are facts.

[mangotango]

The president of the 191,000-member Pa State Education Association is calling upon district locals to "seriously consider" the one-year wage freeze proposal from Corbett. Reactions from local union officials are being described as "tepid."

Some folks might say that a call from the state's top teachers' union officials to "seriously consider" the proposal is weasily crap but, I have to admit, it's WAY more than I thought they'd say. Frankly, I expected the proposal to be dismissed out of hand by teachers.
I guess the talk of furloughs across the state got at least one guy's attention.

[commando72]

I'd rather take a pay freeze for a year than loose my job.

[SirFuego]

I'd rather take a pay freeze for a year than loose my job.

Very true. I think the fact that he is "only" proposing pay freezes is the reason this may have gained traction. It sounds like it's not even a permanent pay freeze either -- just for a year. When you got a normal raise at work, did your take home pay really change THAT much? When all is said and done, teachers that are already living comfortably on their salaries won't really notice a difference. Teachers whose money is already tight will probably need to give up a night out every month to compensate for their rent and other expenses that may have increased. It doesn't sound like a huge sacrifice to be honest.

[commando72]

Teachers whose money is already tight will probably need to give up a night out every month to compensate for their rent and other expenses that may have increased. It doesn't sound like a huge sacrifice to be honest.

Single income earners will see the most impact. About half of our teachers (out of 170) are single income families. Most likely they will be looking to supplement their income. I work with a tree service on the side to pay for heating oil etc. Times are tough and not going to get any better.

Corbett would be smart to take a look at the recall movement in Wisconsin. BTW, Corbett's state approval rating is only 32% as of yesterday.

[Super Scout]

Is anyone happy with any politician ? I see this more as a come one Corbett knew people would be upset but he probably figures if he can scare you (teachers) to cut some he than go back to the drawing board and ask for more cuts else where. If you wanna sell your car for 800 bucks you dont list it at that price you list it at 1,000. I bet his approval rating goes up in 4 years.

[dan58]

Corbett won because he wasn't a democrat.

[HoodRN]

Single income earners will see the most impact. About half of our teachers (out of 170) are single income families. Most likely they will be looking to supplement their income. I work with a tree service on the side to pay for heating oil etc. Times are tough and not going to get any better.

Corbett would be smart to take a look at the recall movement in Wisconsin. BTW, Corbett's state approval rating is only 32% as of yesterday.

I approve of Corbett . Dan58 is right, he was elected because he wasn't a Spendocrat. The recall movement is nothing but a bunch of union theatrics. If the voters wanted the same thing as the unions, Walker wouldn't be governor. BTW, I'm a union member. For now.

[Jimbo]

/\ that is a good point. i think that could work well in pa.

sure there are a lot more teachers than admin. in most schools. but there doesn't need to be as much as there are.

an example would be the hs i went to. it's in a small town. about 900 kids in 7-12 grade. all one schoo/building. our office had 4 secretaries. that didn't include the other office workers who would file papers and other things. all in all there were 10 people who worked in the office. not including the principal and vice principal.


that seems a bit excessive to me

You're 100% right, but forcing the consolidation of districts in PA is meets with huge public resistance. The creation of central valley by mutual agreed upon merger is the exception, not the rule. A few years ago there were some forced consolidations and it resulted in alot of folks getting voted out of office. Now most legislators regard it as political suicide. It might make heaps of sense economically, but voters don't seem to care about that. They care about losing "local control" and their school's football team ceasing to exist.

Local teacher's unions don't have a lot of money, but they belong to and pay dues to PSEA and NEA, which is where their political clout comes into play, not at the local level. If things suck at the local level it is generally the fault of the school board (9 people with pretty much no qualification other than a high school diploma in charge of multimillion dollar bugets with all sorts of favors and personal agendas thrown into the mix) and the administration (who love to fault teachers but always seem to forget that they are the ones who hired those horrible teachers and then did nothing to fire them, and, in fact, probably gave them perfect evaluations year after year).

[HoodRN]

You're 100% right, but forcing the consolidation of districts in PA is meets with huge public resistance. The creation of central valley by mutual agreed upon merger is the exception, not the rule. A few years ago there were some forced consolidations and it resulted in alot of folks getting voted out of office. Now most legislators regard it as political suicide. It might make heaps of sense economically, but voters don't seem to care about that. They care about losing "local control" and their school's football team ceasing to exist.

Local teacher's unions don't have a lot of money, but they belong to and pay dues to PSEA and NEA, which is where their political clout comes into play, not at the local level. If things suck at the local level it is generally the fault of the school board (9 people with pretty much no qualification other than a high school diploma in charge of multimillion dollar bugets with all sorts of favors and personal agendas thrown into the mix) and the administration (who love to fault teachers but always seem to forget that they are the ones who hired those horrible teachers and then did nothing to fire them, and, in fact, probably gave them perfect evaluations year after year).

This is an absolutely accurate assessment .