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Thread: I broke the WJ...

  1. #1
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    I broke the WJ...

    So I decided to go play in the snow a little after work today and apparently something broke in the front end of my WJ... I honestly can’t say if I broke it today or not because the Jeep drives normal with no unusual sounds or handling, etc. and I did have it swamped a few weeks ago. What happened is I was going up a hill (had radio turned up so I never heard a sound) and the Jeep was spinning like crazy and not really going like it should. I have only had this jeep for a couple months and I never actually needed 4wd in the snow yet, I was just thinking wow this thing sucks! When it stopped going forward on the hill I noticed a grinding sound from the right front and the front wheels weren’t spinning. I stopped and put the Jeep in neutral which let whatever is fu**ed up in the front end engage and it pulled out fine with working 4wd but it would just kick out again in a few yards and start grinding. It honestly sounds like a right front axle spinning in the hub but I don’t know. I don’t hear any noise from the front cv joints when driving or anything but I’m not going out in 5 degree weather to craw around under it in my driveway.
    Anyone have any ideas on what I broke?

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    Well I called greensburg driveline and his thoughts are that it’s most likely the spider gears but he can’t get to look at it until at least Monday. I have never messed with changing anything like that and I don’t have a garage to work in at -10 degree weather so it looks like I’ll have to spend some $ on it. Looking at the bright side I may finally end up with a locker in the front!

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    Trail Leader anodyne33's Avatar
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    Well that blows badly. If I were heading out there this weekend I'd definitely open my garage up and we could take a peek inside and at least diagnose it out of the elements. Now I wish I'd left a key stashed someplace.
    [U][quote]An operation this size you don't know who's after you. It could be the ATF, FBI... ****in' Patrik Swayze... who knows?[/quote][/U]

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    Quote Originally Posted by anodyne33 View Post
    Well that blows badly. If I were heading out there this weekend I'd definitely open my garage up and we could take a peek inside and at least diagnose it out of the elements. Now I wish I'd left a key stashed someplace.
    I appreciate your offer on that! I really don’t know all that much about setting up axles, etc. and I can’t stand to know that something is broken inside there so if I take it apart to look it will get a lot more involved than that. It all comes down to the fact that I don’t have a place, the tools, the know how or the spare time to get this done on my own. Even if I only need to replace the spider gears (locker instead) I’m sure I would just end up regearing and changing the bearings once I’m in there (I can’t ever seem to leave well enough alone), so at that point I might as well save myself the hassle and have someone just fix it.
    It would be awesome if this didn’t happen right after Christmas though!

  5. #5
    Less posting, more wheeling! joshs1ofakindxj's Avatar
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    Either spider gears or transfercase. Easiest way to know is inspect the fluids in both to see which has metal flakes in it.

    You're better off paying someone to set up gears. Lot of specialty tools needed and it's a pain in the ass.
    Last edited by joshs1ofakindxj; 01-05-2018 at 03:36 PM.

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    It didn’t seem like the transfer case, the noise was from up front but I won’t know for sure until it gets looked at. If it wasn’t artic cold out I would have been under it finding out the issue. I need a garage!

  7. #7
    Less posting, more wheeling! joshs1ofakindxj's Avatar
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    You and me both. I slapped winter tires on the girlfriends WRX outside last night. I love my arctic Carhartts.

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    Sounds like maybe you snapped the crosspin. If that's a Dana 30 in the front, I have a used Dana 30 at my house. You're welcome to it if you need parts, you just have to take the Dana 35 that goes along with it. Although going from Latrobe to my neck of the woods is quite a haul.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AngusGT View Post
    Sounds like maybe you snapped the crosspin. If that's a Dana 30 in the front, I have a used Dana 30 at my house. You're welcome to it if you need parts, you just have to take the Dana 35 that goes along with it. Although going from Latrobe to my neck of the woods is quite a haul.
    thank you very much for the parts offer, I hope I won’t need to take you up on it though. I’m hoping for just spider gears or maybe even just a bad cv axle (a guy can dream anyway) but who knows. I have decided that if it’s the spiders I’ll probably just put a aussie locker in it and call it a day, but I won’t know until I can actually look at it. I was reluctant to put a lunch box locker in it especially in the front but I keep hearing about how well they actually do for daily driving Street use. I guess I will just have to wait and see.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith View Post
    thank you very much for the parts offer, I hope I won’t need to take you up on it though. I’m hoping for just spider gears or maybe even just a bad cv axle (a guy can dream anyway) but who knows. I have decided that if it’s the spiders I’ll probably just put a aussie locker in it and call it a day, but I won’t know until I can actually look at it. I was reluctant to put a lunch box locker in it especially in the front but I keep hearing about how well they actually do for daily driving Street use. I guess I will just have to wait and see.
    Well, I wish you luck. It looks like this weekend will be a bit warmer, so that should make things easier for you. If you change your mind, let me know. Those axles are just sitting in my garage. As for the locker, I love my Spartan locker. I've always had (or put) a limited slip or a locker in the rear. This is the first time having both a limited slip in the rear and a locker in the front and I couldn't be happier. Gobs of traction and no complaints on-road. When I bought them, I did it with the intention of eventually swapping them out for full carrier lockers like an ARB, but now I'm not so sure it's as high of a priority for me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AngusGT View Post
    Well, I wish you luck. It looks like this weekend will be a bit warmer, so that should make things easier for you. If you change your mind, let me know. Those axles are just sitting in my garage. As for the locker, I love my Spartan locker. I've always had (or put) a limited slip or a locker in the rear. This is the first time having both a limited slip in the rear and a locker in the front and I couldn't be happier. Gobs of traction and no complaints on-road. When I bought them, I did it with the intention of eventually swapping them out for full carrier lockers like an ARB, but now I'm not so sure it's as high of a priority for me.
    yea I am still concerned with the locker going in the front especially in regards to breaking more axles and the overall longevity of the thing, but I figure if I have to work on it I might as well upgrade while I’m doing it. I’m still hoping it’s a broken axle or stripped cv joint (why didn’t they just put a standard universal joint up front like the old days). I’m going to drop it off at greensburg driveline tonight to see what they say.

    Are their any good axle upgrades for these things that are affordable? I looked at the RCV shafts but $1400 into axles for a Dana 30 isn’t going to happen. Any XJ axle shaft swaps or anything like that works on the WJ? The CV joints have to be a weak point.

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    Less posting, more wheeling! joshs1ofakindxj's Avatar
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    You could grab shafts from a 97+ XJ, I believe those had the largest U-joint available in a Dana 30 front shaft. I have seen a front Dana 30 shaft snap once, and it was pretty appropriate circumstances, like a 33"+ tire completely wedged in a rock with a good locker in the differential. I wouldn't waste money on aftermarket upgraded shafts. Just slap in good u-joints and spot weld the caps.

    And definitely do the front aussie locker. They're great.

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    Quote Originally Posted by joshs1ofakindxj View Post
    You could grab shafts from a 97+ XJ, I believe those had the largest U-joint available in a Dana 30 front shaft. I have seen a front Dana 30 shaft snap once, and it was pretty appropriate circumstances, like a 33"+ tire completely wedged in a rock with a good locker in the differential. I wouldn't waste money on aftermarket upgraded shafts. Just slap in good u-joints and spot weld the caps.

    And definitely do the front aussie locker. They're great.
    do you know if they are the right length/spline?

  14. #14
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    Ouch, nevermind, stick with the factory CV shafts: http://mallcrawlin.com/forum/showthr...nversion-on-WJ
    Last edited by joshs1ofakindxj; 01-08-2018 at 01:14 PM.

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    That may have to be a down the road upgrade and wait until it’s warm out and my driveway isn’t a snowy/icy mess. Damn I need a garage!

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    Quote Originally Posted by joshs1ofakindxj View Post
    Ouch, nevermind, stick with the factory CV shafts: http://mallcrawlin.com/forum/showthr...nversion-on-WJ
    There may be cheaper options around by now, that thread is now 11 years old. Hell I can't believe Mallcrawlin is now almost 15 years old, which makes this place even older when it was on different software.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith View Post
    yea I am still concerned with the locker going in the front especially in regards to breaking more axles and the overall longevity of the thing, but I figure if I have to work on it I might as well upgrade while I’m doing it. I’m still hoping it’s a broken axle or stripped cv joint (why didn’t they just put a standard universal joint up front like the old days). I’m going to drop it off at greensburg driveline tonight to see what they say.

    Are their any good axle upgrades for these things that are affordable? I looked at the RCV shafts but $1400 into axles for a Dana 30 isn’t going to happen. Any XJ axle shaft swaps or anything like that works on the WJ? The CV joints have to be a weak point.
    I went with Nitro Chromoly's from ECGS, they were around $525 with free shipping. Between going with a high pinion Dana 30 and swapping in the Chromoly shafts, I'm not worried about breaking anything in the front. The RCV's are awesome, but they're twice the cost of the Chromoly's, plus there's additional work required to make them fit. In the end, I couldn't justify the extra money and work for the RCV's.

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    Premium Supporting Member OverkillZJ's Avatar
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    For what it's worth, when I ran an HP30, I blew up 2 ring gears but my Chromo's held up just fine. I think they were Superior, but it's been awhile.

    I'm not saying ditch the 30/HP30, just that I agree chromo's are probably enough. You're always moving your weak point of course, just don't drive like an idiot. I was good at that. Had a lead foot in reverse and realized I needed an HP60. Then I just blew the transmission

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    Quote Originally Posted by OverkillZJ View Post
    For what it's worth, when I ran an HP30, I blew up 2 ring gears but my Chromo's held up just fine. I think they were Superior, but it's been awhile.

    I'm not saying ditch the 30/HP30, just that I agree chromo's are probably enough. You're always moving your weak point of course, just don't drive like an idiot. I was good at that. Had a lead foot in reverse and realized I needed an HP60. Then I just blew the transmission
    Well driving like an idiot is pretty much what caused this whole mess... I would love to upgrade the axles, etc. but the more I think about it I can buy a lot of $70 replacements for the cost of good chromos. I don’t wheel this thing every weekend or anything and I can’t imagine breaking it that often but I guess time will tell. I’m still thinking that the cv joint is the weak link as far as the axle goes. If I could find a good swap I would go that route but haven’t found a good option yet. I even considered buying cheap stock replacements and cryo treating them for some additional strength. First thing is first though and I need to figure out what’s broke, then consider upgrading it.

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    Well I took the jeep to greensburg driveline and lucky me the front differential is in good shape, it looks like it’s just a bad cv drive shaft. They are going to disconnect the rear drive shaft tomorrow and put a load on the front end to be sure but so far so good. Now I just pray it’s not the transfer case. If it’s only a driveshaft that’s bad I’m going to go ahead and convert to a universal joint type drive shaft.

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    Mark is a good guy to deal with up there. He gets several people on here's business mine included.
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    Premium Supporting Member OverkillZJ's Avatar
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    One thing to keep in mind with those CV shafts: they're a lot strong when the wheels aren't turned, so if you're going to use the stupid pedal in a situation keeping that in mind when picking your line might help!

    Edit: of course u-jointed shafts are stronger when straight too, but I once read that the CV could *theoretically* be even stronger than the stock u-jointed shafts when not turned. I'm not sure how true it is though, especially since the guy talking up that theory blew one up 5 minutes later, haha, but it may be true.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OverkillZJ View Post
    One thing to keep in mind with those CV shafts: they're a lot strong when the wheels aren't turned, so if you're going to use the stupid pedal in a situation keeping that in mind when picking your line might help!

    Edit: of course u-jointed shafts are stronger when straight too, but I once read that the CV could *theoretically* be even stronger than the stock u-jointed shafts when not turned. I'm not sure how true it is though, especially since the guy talking up that theory blew one up 5 minutes later, haha, but it may be true.
    I don’t believe that a rzeppa cv joint is stronger than a universal style joint. I remember my old Bronco II I had in high school with a Rzeppa cv drive shaft that got replaced on a regular basis, it took about 1 burnout to destroy the drive shaft.
    Last edited by Keith; 01-11-2018 at 11:27 AM.

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    Premium Supporting Member OverkillZJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith View Post
    I don’t believe that a rzeppa cv joint is stronger than a universal style joint. I remember my old Bronco II I had in high school with a Rzeppa cv drive shaft that got replaced on a regular basis, it took about 1 burnout to destroy the drive shaft.
    That was always my feeling as well, I was once shown a chart that said otherwise at least based on the 93-95 vs 96-98, but from the amount of busted shafts I saw on the trail I call BS. I'm probably repeating incorrect info, or something that looked better on paper.

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    I destroyed two rezeppa joints out of my WJ almost a year apart. And I didn't even wheel that thing hard. That's when I switched.

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